I is B on the C on AGW

Ah, Information is Beautiful, bringing the clarity that good data visualization provides: Climate Change: A Consensus Among Scientists? They took the numbers provided by petitionproject.org (“31,486 American scientists have signed this petition, including 9,029 with PhDs”), and attempted to put them in a meaningful context.


Our maths here is somewhat coarse. Some better data suggests the ‘consensus’ figure is around 97.5% of publishing climatologists and around 90% of all publishing scientists supporting the human-induced climate theory.

I also thought this part was interesting:

In fact, when you adjust the PetitionProject’s odd categorisation – they filed ‘chemical engineers’ as chemists and physical engineers as ‘physicists’ – the total number of engineers who signed the petition, by our reckoning, jumps to 49%.

Why so many engineers?

Good question. Ideas, anyone? (Disclaimer: My official job title includes the word “engineer.” And even the word “senior.”  Though I’m not sure I’ve really earned either.)

58 Responses to “I is B on the C on AGW”

  1. Smith Says:

    I can’t remember where I saw it, but I read an article that discussed the prevalence of right-wing political ideologies amongst engineers. I cannot remember what argument was made in the article, but I think two of the factors were that the higher expected earnings attract conservatives to the field and engineers attempt to apply engineering strategies and expectations to human nature. If we apply shcb’s claims about the political nature of the climate change debate to the “engineers are conservative” hypothesis, it becomes clear that the engineers are basing their claims not on evidence, but rather on their personal conservative political beliefs.

  2. Smith Says:

    I cannot find the article I read. The closest thing I can find is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salem_hypothesis . It is about Creationism in particular. The article was at least somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but it was an interesting/entertaining read.

  3. shcb Says:

    Engineers tend to be conservative just as artists and teachers tend to be liberal, right brain left brain thing. Chicken and egg thing, did they gravitate to the profession because of their political leanings or vice versa.

    I’ve always been skeptical of this particular poll even though I’m sure I cited it here. I’ve read the questions and seen how they were categorized and it seemed to me to be as blatantly cherry picked as the global warming theories they are criticizing.

    There was a better study early on in this debate, maybe 2004(?) that was better, the scientists actually looked at the data and the methods used to collect it and the majority of them weren’t impressed. Some didn’t think the data supported the conclusion but most just didn’t think the data was collected correctly or the models weren’t accurate.

    Now of course you don’t have to be a climatologist to make those determinations, any scientist, engineer or technician used to working with the scientific method could make that call. Same with any computer programmer who does similar modeling, Charlie Martin for example.

    This debate didn’t start with these emails, it has been going on for almost a decade now.

  4. forbes Says:

    Part of the reason I started blogging regularly (back when I was blogging regularly) was to refute the waves of nonsense emanating from one Steven Den Beste, an engineer from within my own narrow discipline. In article after article Den Beste claimed that – because he’d been trained as an engineer – he could do a superior job of analyzing and finding solutions in fields ranging from foreign policy to energy to economics.

    That Den Beste was a walking example of the Dunning-Kruger Effect in almost all fields outside of wireless telephony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect) never occurred to him, naturally, and of course the wingnuts fawned all over his science-y articles that proclaimed “oil and coal forever!” and “if other nations fear us, terrorists won’t attack us.” As a blogger I was never more than a blip on Den Beste’s radar – his traffic volume was somewhere in the top ten back before he retired from online punditry – but I like to imagine he was driven into retreat, his arguments in disarray, his ego bruised by counter-arguments that revealed the flaws in his vaunted logic, etc.

    Anyhow, I suspect this may be a common fallacy among practitioners of the “hard” sciences – I’ve been trained in SCIENCE! (insert Thomas Dolby music), so my expert analytical skills should be equally useful for solving problems in other fields. Never mind the domain-specific knowledge that I lack, or that the “soft” sciences deal with people and conditions that can’t be reproduced in the lab – clearly, the problem here is that all those economists, climatologists, political scientists, etc. lack the finely honed analytical tools that engineers use on a regular basis.

  5. shcb Says:

    I’m pretty sure that’s not what I said, but now you have said that is what I said so any following comments buy the rest of the crew will be based on what you eluded to what I said rather than what I said, that is what I said or am saying, it is all so confusing, ah hell with it, the conservative is wrong we all know it, doesn’t really matter what he said,let’s move on.

  6. knarlyknight Says:

    I grew up in an environment dominated by engineers (chemical & mechanical) & perhaps my early rebellion against “one answer” rigid thinking is why I’m more of a generalist and fascinated with the alternative solutions. Observing my father over the last 30 years of his life was insightful as he evolved from moderately right wing conservative views to a more liberal outlook on politics, economics and global security type issues while normally maintaining that his view was the one correct view. While his opinions changed over time, his certainty that his views, at that particular point in time were the only correct ones, did not. He was the archetype of engineers, in my eyes.

    This looks interesting:


    good when written in 1996:

  7. shcb Says:

    I can see engineers being self assured, seeing their view as being correct. We are typically in charge of projects that need completion, the dam eventually has to hold water, the product has to get to market. At some point a decision has to be made and one has to have confidence in his decisions to get that done. Maybe that is why teachers tend to be liberal, they can think about stuff all their lives, looking all the possible options and then making a few new ones up if they run short. Nothing wrong with that we need both types of people.

    Your last article was just funny. “The Republican takeover of Congress in 1994” like it was stolen in the night, there were 50 separate elections that led to that takeover.

  8. knarlyknight Says:


  9. knarlyknight Says:

    Off topic. Duck! http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/705.html

  10. shcb Says:

    Well, there are a few other dynamics involved here but this is the reason Milton Friedman disciples have been warning of a W shaped recovery and why it was so important to not incur inflation by expanding government beyond what was necessary. But we have what we have.

  11. NorthernLite Says:

    I just heard Sara Palin has been hired by Fox Noise.

    Hopefully she’ll soon provide some excellent analysis into this whole climate change thing, also.

  12. Smith Says:

    If global warming is real, why is it snowing in Alaska? Dead fish can’t swim against the current when the river is frozen, you betcha.

  13. Craig Says:


    I don’t pretend to be an expert in the climate change cycle discussions. I think it is reasonable to assume that there is a man-made contribution to any warming trends that have been recorded over the decades. I question the “settled” aspect of just to what degree man-made contributions are a factor, and therefore, to what degree man-made changes can significantly and positively affect such temperatures.

  14. shcb Says:

    Thanks Craig,

    Prof Tsonis said that when he published his work in the highly respected journal Geophysical Research Letters, he was deluged with ‘hate emails’.

    You just asked for one, didn’t you JBC?

  15. shcb Says:

    So are you guys upset that Obama is going to spend 25% more on the wars in the Middle East next year than next?

  16. shcb Says:

    oops, change the last next to this

  17. shcb Says:

    …and now they are going to stop tracking the number of jobs created or saved by stimulus money, they are just going to add up the payroll of those that get stimulus money to determine if the stimulus is working, of course that will include the folks that were in no danger of losing their jobs. I don’t know what they are going to use for a formula, maybe the global warming guy in England, Jones was his name wasn’t it can help them out. Since he is out of work right now maybe he can make a model to track the success, he seems to have a knack of getting the numbers to agree with the agenda of politicians.

  18. Smith Says:

    Sure. Maybe one day we will stop electing right-wingers for president. A man can dream….

  19. Smith Says:

    That comment is directed at war spending, not shcb’s whining about the stimulus/global warming/whatever nonsense.

  20. shcb Says:

    Yeah, Obama, Rove and Limbaugh get together from time to time to plot the next right wing takeover.

  21. knarlyknight Says:

    Smith, it is not going to happen in the next ten years, and if by some fluke a non-right wing, non-authoritarianistic president is elected then he/she will not last long because the war-based faction of your economy is so profitable and strong. There needs to be a major shift in America’s (& the world’s) investment spending priorities towards a greater and more powerful peaceful goal (counteracting AGW seemed promising for a while). Until such a shift occurs and as a result the military/industrial powerbrokers diminish in influence, we can expect business as usual. Any presidential hopeful who fights against the current (e.g. Ron Paul) will be neutralized before they are elected, or if they’re elected then the neutering will occur soon after if they maintain their fight against that dominant economic current.

  22. knarlyknight Says:


    Upset that war spending is going up 25%? No, it would be more accurate to say I’m dissappointed (i.e. my faint hope for change seem to be dashed) and sad at the prospect that earth seems likely to be subjected to more carnage.

    But whether I’m upset or not depends on how that money is spent, i.e. depends on tactics. If new fronts are opened with major invasions and bombing campaigns (e.g. Yemen or Iran) then the world misery index will increase, but if the money is spent primarily on defensive and security oriented initiatives in places like Afghanistan, Yemen and Sudan (e.g. the Navy’s new anti-pirating stealth trimarans are so cool!) then there may still be a faint hope for a happier planet.

    If the tactic is to continue with Bush’s existing big offensives and losing Billions of dollars in cash (that’s semi-trailers full of hundred dollar bills) to foreign and domestic contractors and security firms in Iraq and Afghanistan, then personally it’s not a big deal for me as I’ll learn to cope with a far stronger Canadian dollar vs. the US dollar. :-)

  23. shcb Says:

    It’s going to be both, those new ships need the support of a traditional navy, they are just little costal vessels that need air support (but they are cool). At some point you are going to have to hold land to defeat an enemy so the invasions will continue, they have to. You have to have intel, and you have to be there to get the intel. You can’t hit targets with drones without boots on the ground unless you want massive civilian death counts. Niether Bush nor Obama designated the realities of war.

  24. Smith Says:

    “the next right wing takeover.”

    “Next”? This one’s been going since at least Regan, and it shows no signs of stopping.

    “(e.g. Ron Paul)”

    I hope you are suggesting merely suggesting that Paul is opposed to increased military action and not claiming that he is any less “authoritarian” than any other candidate. True, he is anti-federalist, but he is all for expanding power at the state level. He is a confederalist, not a libertarian.

  25. knarlyknight Says:

    Smith, yes I was merely referring to his position on the use of the military. But thanks too for advising of confederalist aspect, I’ll keep that in mind.

  26. Smith Says:

    At first I thought it was a broader claim, but on second reading, I realized you probably just meant the military aspect. I had already typed up most of the comment, so I went ahead and submitted it.

  27. NorthernLite Says:

    Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes … known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few.… No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.”

    — James Madison, Political Observations, 1795

  28. enkidu Says:

    Am I mad that Obama is going to spend 25% more on our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? I am unhappy that bush botched, then ignored, then underfunded the Afghan effort. By allowing OBL to escape, to allow AQ to reform and recruit in Afghanistan/Pakistan and places like Yemen and Somalia, bush and his merry band of morans have made this world significantly less ‘safe’. bush left a heck of a mess behind: Obama is doing a decent job of cleaning it all up (you can’t fix eight years of mistakes in a year folks).

    wwnj: are you mad that we are spending money at home on infrastructure and green jobs rather than killing folks in them “mud hut countries”?

    I posted this below, but I think this guy needs more airtime:

  29. shcb Says:

    seems to me we’re spending on both

  30. Smith Says:

    “Obama is doing a decent job of cleaning it all up”

    Got some examples of this? I’m looking for actions, not speeches.

  31. enkidu Says:

    Well Mr Smith, since you asked so nicely (note that these are off the top of my pointy little head, without so much as a single stop to chat w the great and powerful goog via Al’s Amazing Intertubes):

    1) the US economy hasn’t completely collapsed, and indeed is showing signs of recovery – avoiding a Greater Depression thru stimulus, bank propping and GM buying (plus the cool steady confidence that a real leader brings) I’d call that a modest success

    2) closing Gitmo – it is happening, just not as quickly as one might want. Plus we are actually trying and convicting where appropriate. minus points for indefinite detentions and a continuance of bush era policies… but still a net positive score

    3) we don’t torture any more (big plus – torture doesn’t work and is counterproductive)

    4) a (somewhat botched) healthcare reform bill will probably make it thru this year (no public option? epic fail, but it is a start)

    5) transparency in gov initiatives proceed apace (ok the hcr bill won’t be in front of the cameras, so call this half a point, but honestly do you think the bush regime would have come out with any info about the undie bomber without subpoenas?) Gov2.0 is coming

    6) we are finally pulling out of Iraq (ok, mostly) Putting bushie’s 3 trillion dollar fuckup behind us is a good thing, wouldn’t you agree?

    7) Dick Cheney no longer subverts our laws and Constitution on a daily basis (why we can’t get that sh!tstain off the TV [and in jail] is beyond me) OK this isn’t a big Obama action, but it is nice not to have a creepy criminal as our #2

    8) prosecutions of bush era crimes have landed the perps in jail (ok, this one is clearly a joke. If you don’t punish the lawbreakers they will just do it again – and again and again)

    9) Obama is actually capable of speaking coherently (unlike shrub, palin and wwnj) yeah I know this one might be in the “speeches” category, but it IS nice to have a leader who isn’t a complete dipsh!t and can actually think and speak on his feet.

    10) Obama is committed to actually wrapping up Afghanistan successfully

    11) plus Obama has kept us safe longer than shrubco
    (we are well past 9/11/09) ;)

    12) Obama supports global zero and is working w the former sovs to further reduce nukes (this one is still at the early stages, give the guy a few years, maybe a second term)

    I am sure I could do a better job of listing the (somewhat modest) successes of the Obministration, but they came in at a time of unprecedented mega failure after mega failure after mega failure and have done a decent (not perfect) job of fixing many things all at once.

    I could make a list of failures or fumbles, but you asked for examples of successes.

  32. Smith Says:

    1) I can give some points here, I guess; however, there seems to have been very little done so far to address the underlying issues that have gotten us where we are now. Where is the meaningful regulation designed to decrease the likelihood or at least control the effects of a future bubble burst? Economic downturns are somewhat inevitable, but perhaps we should consider doing something to lessen the impact in the future.

    2) I would also deduct points for the assertion that we can still detain “enemy combatants” even if they are found not guilty. Closing Gitmo is a nice symbolic gesture, but if all we are going to get are show trials with predetermined outcomes, I don’t think we have really moved beyond the policies of the previous administration.

    3) Assuming this is true, it is a big plus.

    4) I wonder just how much improvement the current bill will result in. I’m more inclined to deduct points here for producing what appears to be little more than a welfare plan for private insurance companies. Additionally, Obama really hasn’t done a very good job of pushing for or promoting this bill. Other than the brief media blitz in the fall, he has been pretty hands off here.

    5) I’m not so sure this is actually happening. What are some of the initiatives that are proceeding?

    6) Pulling out is good (condoms are safer, though). ;)

    7) Not being Bush is not really an accomplishment.

    8) Good joke

    9) See number 7

    10) I like the wrapping up part, but how do we measure success?

    11) Meh. “(Name of President) has kept us safe for (amount of time)” is a somewhat hollow talking point. I think this has less to do with the pres and more to do with intelligence agencies and the plots/timelines being used by those who would attack the U.S.

    12) No problems here.

    I’m probably expecting too much out of him in one year, but he set high expectations for himself during the campaign. Furthermore, his party controls congress, and he still seems to be struggling to get legislation through. I guess much of his presidency is going to hinge on the eventual outcomes of healthcare, Afghanistan, and the economy. A lot can change in the next three years, but I can’t help but feel that his first year has been a disappointment, especially to liberals.

  33. shcb Says:

    You’re more generous than I would have been Smith. You specifically asked for something Obama has done not what he said he is going to do and Enky went off giving you a laundry list of things he has said he will do. Like every president he can’t control congress so some of these items are out of his control, health care for instance, but all the prisoners in Gitmo could have been on C17s the second day of his presidency, gotta party on the first day. But I thought the “he’s not Bush” accomplishment was the most precious.

  34. NorthernLite Says:

    I think, considering the Democrats control both Houses and the White House, they really haven’t accomplished a whole lot. Then again, it’s only been a year so I’m willing to give them a little more time. Don’t think I’ll hold my breath though.

    I think they’ve handled the economic disaster they inherited quite well.

    I think he’s changed the tone in world relations for the positive. That cowboy diplomacy from the previous bunch was leading the world down a dangerous path.

    But overall I feel he’s been quite disappointing as far as progressive policy is concerned. I mean, isn’t this guy supposed to be “the most Liberal president ever”, a “socialist”?


  35. Smith Says:

    He’s the socialest.

  36. enkidu Says:

    the socialest LOL!

    1) totally agree not happy that the banksters walked away without a scratch and with their damn bonuses. The time of maximum leverage is past. Still, we will move incrementally in the right direction here. Certainly better than the bush years and lightyears better than a McCain or Palin pres (shudders).

    2) I think they need some solid prosecutions to get things going. That is exactly what they are doing. Overall net positive imho

    3) bush co institutionalized torture. This is no longer tolerated. We are once again a nation of Laws (at least in this narrow issue)

    4) agree completely that the insurance industry won this round hands down (same for pharma), but there are some very good parts to the bill.

    5) transparency is increasing, accountability, web2.0/gov2.0 is moving much faster under O than shrubco. I’ll try to dig up some links. but yes, the whole, we’ll have cameras and cspan for these meetings, er, ooops actually not… is very disappointing. Still a strong net positive thus far (it has only been a year)

    6) usa condones!

    7) it sure as hell is a accomplishment – turning the ship of state from the off the rocks where the last bunch of morans left it is indeed an accomplishment. not being a complete moran? accomplishment ;)

    8) wishful thinking

    9) I think the rest of the world sees Obama as a repudiation of the shrubco neocon war mongering lies and destruction. This may actually involve speeches rather than guns, shocking I know!

    10) We measure success that the Afghans start moving toward the 21st century. We defuse the islamic radicals not by sending the bombers and drones every time. We kill when we have to but we use smarter sticks and carrots. Strike a deal w the Israeli occupation, making Israel just one more nation amongst many (normalize relations w neighbors, stop support for their belligerence). These things are all wrapped up in the same hairball.

    11) is leetle joke – but it is true: newsflash for you wwnjs we were hit multiple times under shrubco. oh right some nutcase tried to blow his junk off and was subdued by a dutch guy (commence eye rolling).

    12) this would ratchet down useless spending, reduce global tension and we regain the moral high ground while retiring old cold war thinking and hardware. If we make the sovs and the chinese our friends and partners, who is the next boogeyman? I mean other than some 5th century whackjobs hiding in caves on the af/pak border. And cranky old wwnjs in teh South: those guys are armed to the teeth.

    Obama is the Great Compromiser. Yet ‘socialism’ is taking a stake in GM so it doesn’t go belly up (where we’ll actually turn a profit this year? socialism!) If socialism is opening the money spigot to extra wide so the world’s banking system doesn’t burn, well wouldn’t a ‘socialist’ like the most liberal liberal who ever liberalled a liberal like Osama, er Obama want huge failures so he could re-architect the future of mankind? No. They hewed to the middle of the road. They kept everything pretty much the same. Bubbles and all. A missed opportunity for real reform.

    We need to keep building progressive voices. Keep pushing from the liberal, progressive, the fair and decent center. I don’t hear virtually any far left voices (Bernie Sanders? come on) We need to grow a green and progressive future and it doesn’t start with toads like Harold Ford or the blue dogs.

    Sorry for long post – have a nice day!

  37. NorthernLite Says:

    Actually you raised a helluva good point enk. As dissapointed as I am with some of Obama’s performances, at least it’s not McCain / Palin.

    Shudder indeed.

    I saw a clip yesterday when she was on Glen “Cry Me A River” Beck’s show and he asked her who her favourite founding father was. In typical Palin style she anwered with, “All of them!”. Even Beck called that answer BS. She ended going with George Washington after a little bit of blabbering. Now who wants to bet me she chose him because that’s the only one she knows?


  38. shcb Says:

    Between McCain, Obama, Biden, and Palin I would venture to guess that McCain is the only one that has ever given that question any thought, but Obama would have had the answer memorized.

  39. NorthernLite Says:

    I think it’s well known that Obama knows the history of your great country very well and I’m sure he would have a thoughtful answer to that question.

  40. enkidu Says:

    re 12) this just popped up on crooksandliars.com


    Super Socialest to the rescue!

    Read the entire BAS statement (damn librl scientists!)


    “A key to the new era of cooperation is a change in the U.S. government’s orientation toward international affairs brought about in part by the election of Obama. With a more pragmatic, problem-solving approach, not only has Obama initiated new arms reduction talks with Russia, he has started negotiations with Iran to close its nuclear enrichment program, and directed the U.S. government to lead a global effort to secure loose fissile material in four years. He also presided over the U.N. Security Council last September where he supported a fissile material cutoff treaty and encouraged all countries to live up to their disarmament and nonproliferation obligations under the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty …”

  41. shcb Says:

    That is funny was that from Saturday Night Live?

  42. Smith Says:

    “McCain is the only one that has ever given that question any thought”

    McCain 04, maybe, it’s not likely, but I’ll grant it is possible. McCain 08 would just parrot whatever the RNC told him.

  43. knarlyknight Says:

    Apparently Canadian prisons are chock fuull of good role models. Hey, I’m as shocked at that as you. I’d love to see the expression on shcb’s face as he reads this “liberal” report about our infamous radical Islamic nut job repenting for his “former” evil self.

    In America, years of torture may have ended with a life sentence for this guy, but here in Canada it’s looking like a few years of introspective koombyya type support groups behind bars will be followed by early probation and a few thousand hours of community service (involving washing windows at a boarding school called “Our Blessed Virgin’s Academy of Perpetual Desire”) That’ll teach him.


  44. knarlyknight Says:

    Re: Our Founding fathers, I’m surprised Palin didn’t start yapping on about her dear old Dad.

  45. Smith Says:

    There is something funny about a fierce partisan like Palin choosing Washington as her favorite Founding Father.

  46. knarlyknight Says:

    Maybe she liked his hair style?

  47. knarlyknight Says:

    Hey Enk,
    You know what’s great about Lies.com lately? Instead of Lefty seagull poop, we have Smith’s value addeds. And teachervet must be training former Taliban troops in Afghanistan or something.

  48. shcb Says:

    I tell you, you guys did everything possible to bolster the naïve liberal stereotype yesterday.

  49. enkidu Says:

    Why do you blather that wwnj?

    Because I linked to the bureau of atomic scientists turning the clock back? (just a minute, but it is only year one of eight) Them ding egghead scientists.

    Or is it the almost universal belief amongst non-wrong-wing-nut-jobs that Dick Cheney should be in jail?

    Or that Smith finally realizes just what a waste of time it is to ‘debate’ you seriously?

    Do tell! We need more material to make fun of today.

  50. Smith Says:

    Almost as much as you’ve done to bolster the racist conservative stereotype?

  51. shcb Says:

    The bit about Russia and Iran was just knee slapn’ funny. Whenever I hear a liberal say something like that with a straight face I think of Galaxy Quest. Do you people know how the real world actually works?

  52. Smith Says:

    Talkin’s for pussies. Real ‘merkins bomb everyone. Yippee-kai-yay Mother Russia.

    Had to look up Galaxy Quest. Nothing like comparing foreigners to reptiles to counter the claims that conservatives are xenophobic racists.

  53. enkidu Says:

    Yes, I can see how a group of atomic scientists citing Obama’s diplomatic efforts would be knee slapn, fake teef loosnin, beer belly shakin, redneckcap scratchin, gun droppin, bigot befuddlingly funny to yall.

    Those aren’t my words wwnj: try reading the PDF link. See how the clip in my post is in a block quote? Your assumption that they is all librlz is just arugula chokin, chardonnay spritzing, volvo crashing, socialestically teh funny!

    Hey did yall catch boss Limbaugh’s comments on thet there “mud hut country” wut was hit by an erfquake? nope, no bigotry or wwnj whackdoodlry here folks, move along, move along.

  54. knarlyknight Says:

    Okay, I was not convinced of the racist accusations against our dear wwnj, but with this:

    Had to look up Galaxy Quest. Nothing like comparing foreigners to reptiles to counter the claims that conservatives are xenophobic racists.

    I can no longer deny that the accusations have full merit.

  55. enkidu Says:

    here knarly, you can just read wwnj’s own words:


    my fav is wwnj’s “breeding to a lazy man” (shouldn’t talk about your son in law like that), but “mud hut countries” is a great example as well. I am sure you could dig up more, but these are the phrases that I recalled off the top of my pointy lil head.

  56. shcb Says:

    Danger Will Robinson, Danger! The conservative is getting close! Break out the race card!

  57. Smith Says:

    Damn liberals, always calling people who say racist things “racist”. Don’t they realize the 1st Amendment requires them to tolerate my intolerance?

  58. enkidu Says:

    “My grandmother was not a highly educated woman, but she told me as a small child to quit feeding stray animals. You know why? Because they breed. You’re facilitating the problem if you give an animal or a person ample food supply. They will reproduce, especially ones that don’t think too much further than that. And so what you’ve got to do is you’ve got to curtail that type of behavior. They don’t know any better”

    This sounds so… familiar…


Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.