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Rush Loses the Torture Argument on His Own Show

Enjoy:

This entry was posted by jbc on Tuesday, April 7th, 2009 at 8:09 pm and is filed under the_media, the_usa, torture. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

24 Responses to “Rush Loses the Torture Argument on His Own Show”

knarlyknight Says:
April 7th, 2009 at 10:28 pm
Why would anyone listen that abusive idiot? The caller nailed him with the brainwashed fascist accusation, it sticks:

Since August 2002, nearly 100 detainees have died while in the hands of U.S. officials in the global “war on terror.” According to the U.S. military’s own classifications, 34 of these cases are suspected or confirmed homicides; Human Rights First has identified another 11 in which the facts suggest death as a result of physical abuse or harsh conditions of detention. In close to half the deaths Human Rights First surveyed, the cause of death remains officially undetermined or unannounced. Overall, eight people in U.S. custody were tortured to death.

Despite these numbers, four years since the first known death in U.S. custody, only 12 detainee deaths have resulted in punishment of any kind for any U.S. official. Of the 34 homicide cases so far identified by the military, investigators recommended criminal charges in fewer than two thirds, and charges were actually brought (based on decisions made by command) in less than half. While the CIA has been implicated in several deaths, not one CIA agent has faced a criminal charge. Crucially, among the worst cases in this list – those of detainees tortured to death – only half have resulted in punishment; the steepest sentence for anyone involved in a torture-related death: five months in jail.

http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/us_law/etn/dic/exec-sum.asp
NorthernLite Says:
April 8th, 2009 at 7:11 am
That was fucking awesome.
CKL Says:
April 8th, 2009 at 7:17 am
I was amazed at how Rush spoke. Listen to him, really. It’s almost as if he WANTS to give the impression that the republican party is this hyper organized entity which is merely biding it’s time until it strikes. Woe be to those who decry them now, for their comeuppance is forthcoming…

Scary stuff when he’s merely a personality reflective of the attitude pervading the most hardest of core neoconservatives. Who no doubt have doppelgangers in the democrat camp. That much lust for control – to forsake all human decency – is simply mind boggling.

I used to think my father was exaggerating when he would tell me how close we were under Nixon. Just now do I realize that there is a very real struggle between evil and extremely evil for control of this world.
enkidu Says:
April 8th, 2009 at 7:47 am
torture is wrong.
end of story.

I like the drug addict’s response: well, you aren’t a REAL Republican, because you aren’t radical enough!

Please please please! keep this obese drug addled viagra popping loudmouthed trainwreck as the leader of the R party. I don’t want to silence him, I want everyone to hear what an utter douchebag moran this guy is. Sure 20% of Americans will listen and go “duh… right!” But the vast majority of America is repulsed by this kind of hate radio.
knarlyknight Says:
April 8th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
CKL – very scary. But unlike the Nazi’s, if there is a next time then the fascists will have access to every iota of data about your existence ever entered into a municipal, state, federal, library, or internet data bank, etc. & you can expect their ruthlessness to be high tech and total.
shcb Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 11:25 am
Now Obama wants even more billions to throw at these holes of Iraq and Afghanistan to fight a failed mission, in a failed war on a peace loving people that only want ten million for a ship worth many millions more. Just give them all our money and maybe they will go away, we gave them 20% of out budget in the late 1700’s and they went away, well sort of, we eventually had to kill a bunch of them but they sort of went away. We are spending all this money on things that kill people and break things when we could just give them the money so they can build things that kill people and break things (us and ours), people wake up! This president is ruining our reputation as a paper tiger by spending more money in these failed wars. And what about all the green house gasses the Bainbridge used to get to the lifeboat. (ironic that the namesake fought against pirates and the last iteration of the USS Bainbridge was nuclear).

And now Dodd has to chose between pissing off the administration or the unions, you gotta love it.
enkidu Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 11:52 am
incoherent as always
looks like you’ve been drinking in the morning again

btw, when is your explanation of macho mike’s awesome taxamagical ‘formula’ going to be all hammered out? Try for coherence, just this once. You can do it!
just a suggestion: sober up first

cheers (no that is not a signal to start drinking again)
shcb Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 12:10 pm
it’s gumbay! in Chinese, the one word I learned there, lots of practice. I’m sorry, I should have been more clear, you probably haven’t heard anything on these topics in the Soros media, you guys should get out more, there is a whole world of news going on.
enkidu Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 1:03 pm
george Soros owns the BBC now?

seriously shcb, drinking in the AM explains a great deal about you.

You stagger into this thread, babble some stuff about pirates and paper tigers and Chris Dodd (boooo!) and when I ask you (yet again) to explain your magic formula, you instead give us a lesson in drinking salutations in Chinese (it sounds a lot like “kampai!” which is Japanese for “down the hatch!” “here’s mud-in-yer-eye!” or “Bob’s yer uncle!”)
shcb Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
So let’s go down the list:

1. Obama just asked congress for eighty some billion dollars to continue the fight in Iraq, there is a little for disaster relief and a pittance for diplomatic work but the bulk is to continue Bush’s mission in Iraq. Now surely one of you will stand by your man and another couple will stand on your convictions you have been spouting the last couple years; leaving debt to our kids for an illegal war etc. and remember we are supposed to be out of there in a short time, why are we spending 75 billion more?

2. Next we have the pirates that were holding the container ship, the first time that has happened in 200 years. They want 10 million for the ship, now that only the captain is being held maybe the price will go down, whatever the case, the way this problem has been handled by the weaker nations is to simply pay tribute to the Muslims.

2b. This was the tact of the world and the US in dealing with the Pirates of the Barbary Coast in the 1790s.

2c. They too said that the Koran gives them tie right to demand money or kill anyone that doesn’t believe in Allah

2d. The USS Bainbridge has been dispatched to watch over the lifeboat. With the captain and the four pirates it is a gas turbine powered destroyer that had to travel a few hundred miles to get to the scene pumping all that deadly Co2 in the air.

2e. Now the ship to use that name the last time (there have been 5 ships named Bainbridge) was a nuclear powered guided missile cruiser. It would have been “greener” to send the CGN 25 in her day than the DDG-96.

3. The namesake for these ships was a captain in the First Barbary Coast War, he wasn’t very distinguished there, grounding his ship and spending most of the war (19 months) held captive and enslaved, no rules about torture then.

4. Chris Dodd is in a pickle, the unions are getting upset with him because his buddies, the Obama administration, want to cut defense spending my stopping the production of the F-22, but the engines are made in Connecticut, by union guys, and Dodd is the underdog in next years election by EVERY Republican candidate.

Now isn’t any one of these stories more interesting than this Limbaugh piece? I mean come on guys, you can hear 4 or 5 of these calls every month, these calls are no different that Lies.com. Rush (or JBC) throws some red meat to the kids, adds a little inflammatory rhetoric, in this case Rush says the guy isn’t a good Republican, and a few minutes later someone is saying “he’s not even a good American” then he just sits back and lets the unwashed masses flail at the carcass.
shcb Says:
April 9th, 2009 at 4:18 pm
By the way, I have grown to be bored by our previous discussion.

(this is easier playing by rules of Lies.com)
enkidu Says:
April 10th, 2009 at 11:42 am
yes, yes, I am well aware of the news, but your jumbled slant and partisan poltroonery make it difficult to untangle the gordian hairballs that are your posts.

Let me give you an example: I think the number I’ve heard over here in reality is $83B for Iraq and Afghanistan. The big difference is he is putting these numbers in the budget rather than asking for ridiculously huge supplementals like dumbya did.

This is the first time in 200 years that a pirate has taken over a ship? Wow the Wingnutoverse must be really different than reality!

And your whole, “the world sees as a paper tiger (boo hoo hoo)” is beyond hilarious. We have the world’s strongest military by far. We spend more on military than the next 50 nations combined. Our allies comprise the majority of the rest of the world’s high tech military and we have more ready nukes than anyone. We invade and occupy countries on a whim or a pack of lies and there isn’t a damn thing the world can do about it. The UN is pretty much our puppet (much like the world bank) and the headquarters is in NYC. Our culture and technology is swamping the world, changing everything on the planet. Except for exporting our manufacturing base to China, we dominate the world in almost every single metric. But don’t let reality intrude on the Wingnutoverse dear wwnj.

clearly you should put down the bottle and sober up

and as to your complete failure to ‘explain’ macho mike’s taxamagical ‘formula’ with anything approaching a coherent line of reasoning, all I can say is: typical wwnj

You rednecks really are that dumb that you listen to hate radio, take in something that is blatantly false and when it is exposed as such, you can’t actually grow a pair and say, well I guess that was wrong.

owned
knarlyknight Says:
April 10th, 2009 at 7:01 pm
Hey Enk,
I didn’t think that shcb’s silly posts were worth a response, but yours was a fine read in putting the record straight. And I guess that’s always worthwhile, as the “left’s” complacency was probably a lot to do with allowing the public discourse to enter into insane wwnj paradigms with little opposition (those that knew better smiled smuggly to themselves thinking in error that the lunatic Texans under Rove’s leadership were but a passing circus freak show some 9 years ago) thus allowing crackpots to triumph for eight long years.
Myself, with not a great geographical / historical background, still find it amusing that shcb refers to the Somali “pirates” as somehow the second coming of the Barbary Coast pirates of the Ottoman Empire. Somali is a failed state and utterly pales in comparison to the power of the former Ottomans’ against the rest of the world, it’s pirates have a scope within the gulf of aden (relatively far removed from the so-called Barbary Coast) in contrast to the BarbaryCoast pirates who threatened ships as far North as Iceland for crikes sake. Somali’s pirates are a pain in the ass, a hornet’s nest to be dealt with appropriately (such as the several successful French rescues,), but the Somali “pirates” are a far cry from the Barbary Coast Pirate hyperbole that shcb – as our wwnj lightning rod – would have us believe.

Looking at the list of captured, ransomed, and rescued ships, a quick scan seems to indicate the number of attempted piracies are still high, but the success of the pirates have been waning. And a Somali pirate’s success was always doubtful, repulsed attacks where pirates are killed just don’t warrant the same headlines as a tanker and crew that is being held for ransom. And even a “successful” piracy is not over after a ransom is paid, as this (very high) ransom example shows:

The Liberian-flagged ship MV Sirius Star owned by the Saudi oil company Aramco, was hijacked 450 nautical miles southeast of Mombasa, Kenya with 25 crew members aboard. The 330-meter (1080 foot) vessel was carrying crude oil valued at US$100 million. This is the farthest Somali pirates have travelled to hijack a ship, and is far south of the “Maritime Security Patrol Area” patrolled by international warships in the Gulf of Aden.[104] Sirius Star’s captors threatened that the ship would face “disastrous” consequences if a US$25,000,000 ransom was not paid, though they have agreed to accept US$15,000,000 to release the ship.[105]January 11, 2009. The body of a Somali pirate who drowned just after receiving a huge ransom washed onshore with $153,000 in cash, a resident said Sunday, as the spokesman for another group of pirates promised to soon free a Ukrainian arms ship.
Five pirates drowned Friday when their small boat capsized after they received a reported $3 million ransom for releasing a Saudi oil tanker. Local resident Omar Abdi Hassan said one of the bodies had been found on a beach near the coastal town of Haradhere and relatives were searching for the other four.[106]

from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ships_attacked_by_Somali_pirates

and just to put to rest any further silly wwnj comparisons of Somalia’s criminals to the Barbary Coast pirates of yore, please see also:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_pirate
knarlyknight Says:
April 10th, 2009 at 7:07 pm
Seems my post was a bit late. Apparently the recent pirate incident in the Gulf of Adn that has shcb all up in arms and hyperventilating about was nothing that a well organized union couldn’t tackle: http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2009/04/another-miracle-brought-you-americas-unions-time-pirates
shcb Says:
April 12th, 2009 at 5:46 am
In reality the 75 billion is for both wars, I am just playing by Lies.com rules of debate, I just left out some of the information that gave my point less impact; as I said this is much easier.

This is the first time a US flagged ship has been pirated in 200 years. And yes there are many parallels with the Barbary Coast pirates, starting with the doves wanting to pay them off and TJ and GW wanting to kill them, the Muslin roots and the belief God give them the right to extort money from the West and on and on.
shcb Says:
April 12th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
Bully!!!

way to go Obama!

The operation, personally approved by President Barack Obama,

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,514775,00.html
NorthernLite Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 6:55 am
See, you have nothing to worry about. He’s a strong, decisive leader.

Good job Obama!
shcb Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 8:11 am
I was never really worried about his military resolve, maybe a little concerned, but not worried, I thought he was a good man that would do the right thing in a real crisis. I’m just glad he did well in a small crisis, those are the ones that really test a person and are easy to let get out of hand. It also seems at this early point in the story he simply gave the ok to let the people on the scene to make the final decisions, something Carter and Johnson never seemed to understand.

Good job Obama!

I still have problems with his socialism :-)
enkidu Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 8:28 am
pace your rage wwnj, it has only been 10 weeks or so

socialism? you should visit wikipedia and check up on that term
asking banks that take billions in bail out funds to accept federal oversight, partial ownership and federal guidelines seems very prudent and has done more to restore confidence in structures that were severely eroded during the dumbya era. We are long way from out of the woods yet, but calling libs fascists/socialists etc is ridiculous.

Where were you when the last bunch of criminals were dismantling the Constitution? oh yeah, cheerleading and threatening violence to anyone who disagreed with you. He’s the Deciderator! Well lil ricki when the guy you didn’t vote for gets elected, what do you expect? We will be busy for years and years fixing all the crap you idiots broke.

I am more disappointed that the Obama admin is appealing the ruling that prisoners need to be charged with, well, something to be held by US forces. Combine that with his letting the torturers off the hook (pun intended) and things do look less than perfect from a progressive viewpoint.

Let the game play out a bit, don’t let up on the new administration and pace yourselves people. Not quite 3 months out of 48 to 96… quick wwnj, what is that % in Wingnutoverse numbers? 51%?
NorthernLite Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 9:37 am
And now that you can, you should visit Varadero, Cuba sometime. I was there last year and it was awesome. People are very friendly and the beaches were beautiful!
shcb Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 9:51 am
I would like to visit there sometime, it looks quite nice. How was the political atmosphere? I enjoyed my time in China and never felt threatened, but there was just that little undertone of a threat. Like when we asked our hosts about the security guards at our plant, they wouldn’t answer, suddenly forgetting English. That sort of thing. Did you notice anything similar? Is the area you are talking about a tourist area? If it is, did you venture off the beaten path any?

I have no hidden agenda here I am genuinely interested.
NorthernLite Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 12:48 pm
Actually I didn’t feel threatened at all during the trip, and we did venture out a few times, but it was on bus tours. I didn’t go to the night clubs or anything like I did in Mexico. But people were very friendly and the beaches were stunning. Yes, Veradero is a bigtime tourist area, very popular with Canadians in the heart of winter. There were a lot more soliders standing around there than any other place I’ve been though (outside of the resort areas).

Still, for $700 CDN for 1 week all inclusive 5 Star…

Probably be much cheaper for you guys due to the currency difference and shorter flight times.
shcb Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 1:58 pm
wow! that is a great price, I will check into it. Personally, sitting on a beach for a week fits me just fine, I really don’t feel the need to venture too far off the beaten path. I had a friend that loved to rent a jeep and go on his own or hop on a plane with the chickens and hogs to get to some backwoods area of Mexico, not for me.
NorthernLite Says:
April 13th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
lol me niether!

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Rush Loses the Torture Argument on His Own Show

24 Responses to “Rush Loses the Torture Argument on His Own Show”

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